HOT TOPIC! Eclipse Gene/Abyssinian

[Gary Orner]

Is Eclipse and Abyssinian a different trait or one in the same?

post your opinions and post your findings if you have bred these traits. Please be respectful and know everyone has an opinion.

 

[Gary Orner]

In my humble opinion Abyssinian is nothing more then an eclipse without the eye pigment. As you can breed eclipse and get Abyssinian. Also you breed two Abyssinian you will get eclipse.

Eclipse at one time use to be thought to be a weird trait. i was told at one time if you breed eclipse to eclipse sometimes you will get non eclipse animals. Now today we know that is now true and that sometimes the animal does not have the eye pigment.

 

[acpart]

I am just getting started with eclipses this year. I bred a het eclipse to another het to prove out the trait (yes, they are both het) and then bred an eclipse 50% het tremper to a tremper to prove out the albino (yes, she's het albino). Interestingly, I got a number of albino snake eyes from this pairing and one with eyes so dark I thought it was an eclipse until it got a little bigger.

I've had no experience with Abyssinians, but did read this definition on Ron Tremper's website:
Definition of an Abyssinian = A paradox leopard gecko that has red vein lines in the eyes and that can express every color on the body except for black pigment. Adults have a speckled tail and often a very faded look. Some people might classify this morph as a type of albino as seen in hooked-billed birds.

Later on, he says that his Abs appeared first in Eclipse x Raptor crosses. From that , I see how you're suggesting that Abs are just an Eclipse without the eye color. It leads me to a more interesting question --what makes an eclipse an eclipse? Is it eye color, white nose, both? Why do some eclipses lose their eye color as they mature? Are all snake eyed geckos eclipses? There has been some evidence that people have produced eclipse eyes from older Tremper albinos (the Tremper male that produced the snake eyed babies was born in 2004). WHy is that happening?

ALiza

 

[Gary Orner]

All great questions.

I can not answer all of them. I can say though I know the eclipse gene at one time was very confusing for even some of the top breeders. When I got into it I bought a Raptor male. I was told that I would produce some animals without the eclipse eyes if I bred him to eclipse or a raptor.

I never did at that time.

But this year I have produced an animal that were snake eyes and now have no pigment in the eye as an adult.

IMO Eclipse can effect the eyes and still does in the ABY. But all in all they are the same. You can take an ABY breed to an eclipse and get all eclipse. Snake eyes are eclipse. IMO the gene is the gene.

 

[indyana]

Could this be like the different varieties of Snow, where the genes are at the same location but slightly different? These genes are recessive, not dominant, so in order to get expression the geckos would have to have two copies of "not normal" alleles, but having the different mixes could explain the differing phenotypes (eclipse/eclipse, eclipse/abyssinian, abyssinian/abyssinian).

I'll admin I haven't read up much on Abyssinian, as it isn't something I've frequently run across.

 

[OhioGecko]

What is an abyssinian? JK

 

[GreatGeckos]

All I know is that I've bred 2 het abys to eachother and produced animals that 2 het eclipses would have never produced. I mean stuff like jungles and stripes... Although all save for 1 of my eclipse are patternless stripe. I also only bred het abys 1 time. I produced 2 abys? and various other types of geckos from this pairing. From my exsperience they're like eclipses with hidden polygenic traits that show up in some of the offspring if you bred hets together atleast. But polygenics show to a varying degree in parents and get more obvious in the offspring when you focus on 2 parents with the strong desired trait ,the hets abys didn't have these traits and they showed up in the babies rondomly ? More test breeding please.... Lol
I stopped breeding them honestly because I didn't hatch really mind blowning stuff and I don't have the space to carry such a project as long as I think this one may have required.

 

[Gary Orner]

I get reverse stripes, Patternless Stripes, Jungle, snake eyes, full eclipse. And even weird stripes from Eclipse and het eclipse...


I have produced over 100 eclipsed animals this year should be well over 400 next year

 

[Gary Orner]

From a Het

I get a lot of patterns from it. Even Abby from eclipses

 

[acpart]

Do you think there's a relationship between the eclipse eyes and the patterns? I would think they're independent of each other. I think stripes are still not entirely understood. Last season I got a reverse stripe from a banded tremper and a banded het tremper het blizzard. No eclipse involved.

Aliza

 

[Gary Orner]

Very much so. I think line bred traits are bred into everything and they sit there waiting to come out.

Hypo being the main one. I mean look at a wild leopard.... Spots Spots Spots... Rarely see that anymore

 

[GreatGeckos]

Like I said before all of my eclipse are patternless, and when I bred 2 paternless het Abs together it produced stuff I've never seen from eclipse .